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Fomer USMC officer to ARNG enlisted

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  • Fomer USMC officer to ARNG enlisted

    LTC Richie, or anyone else who may be able to help, I am a former USMC officer who is enlisting in the ARNG on 3/27/2014. My recruiter informed me today that there was some discussion between MEPs and NGB that I would have to attend BCT, but that it was ultimately determined that I would not. Does anyone know if this is correct? BCT is a showstopper for me at this stage in my life. I don't want to get to MEPs to sign my contract and this issue arise without some knowledge about the requirements.

    Additionally, I've been told I will attend a MOSQ course (19d). I know this course is two weeks and six days. Is there any chance I would have to attend a full AIT? Like BCT, this is a showstopper for me.

    How do I ensure when I sign my contract that BCT and AIT are off the table?

    Any response is greatly appreciated.

    V/r

  • #2
    Prior Service Marines enlisting into the Army National Guard are not required to attend Basic Combat Training (BCT) and will report directly to their assigned unit.

    Normally, your assigned unit schedules your MOSQ course and its almost always the shorter NG/Reserve course instead of the full active duty AIT.
    Last edited by SF Hunter; March 21st, 2014, 05:41 PM.

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    • #3
      I was aware of this policy. However, the apparent sticking point was whether Officer Candidate School would be considered equivalent to BCT. Marine officers do not attend recruit training and then go on to a BOLC like course. OCS takes the place of recruit training (or BCT). OCS is ten weeks of basic officer training. It is followed by six months of The Basic School which is provisional infantry platoon commander skills. I think the disconnect was my attendance at OCS and not recruit training.

      Thanks for the quick response.

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      • #4
        I strongly recommend that you NOT sign a contract if you lack confidence in the answers to these questions. Also, please comment as to your highest grade honorably held, and your grade at enlistment in the ARNG.

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        • #5
          Oops, I accidentally edited out my response. I was an O-3 and will be enlisting as an E-5. My recruiter did indicate I should walk away if I didn't get satisfactory answers to my questions. She also noted I would not be attending BCT/AIT, but I have nothing in writing. Will the enlistment contract address these issues?
          Last edited by Devildawgtiger; March 21st, 2014, 10:02 PM.

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          • #6
            What made you want to pursue the enlisted route?

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            • #7
              I found out the hard way that Marine officers still go in front of promotion boards while in the IRR. Thus, despite having excellent fitness reports, I was passed over for promotion twice as I failed to submit promotion packages. Had I done so, I would have been promoted without question as everyone I knew was promoted. I also found out that this is a common mistake as it happened to my roommate from active duty also. With that being said, I'm very excited about enlisting. I've only got six good years towards retirement, so I will hopefully have a good, long enlisted career ahead of me.

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              • #8
                Marine OCS is harder than Marine Boot Also, in regards to AIT, usually the Guard has condensed schools in regards to MOS reclass at satellite locations that meet AD PMI. If long durations of training are a show stopper, what happens if you deploy?

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                • #9
                  I don't doubt OCS is tougher. I just need to get the Guard to realize that. I have no issue with deployment. It comes with the job. I just have no desire to do 16 weeks of OSUT. I'll be 40 this year. I've already done 9 months of basic military training between OCS and The Basic School. I have professional and family obligations that I would prefer not to interrupt for training like OSUT. For deployment, just say the word and I'll pack my bags with a smile on my face.

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                  • realitycheck
                    realitycheck commented
                    Editing a comment
                    What was your branch/job as a USMC officer?

                • #10
                  I was a judge advocate. I think this might have been part of the issue. I'm assuming NGB thought I was Corps officer like lawyers in the Army. However, all Marine officers are line officers and thus go through the same training. There are no direct commissions in the Marines.

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                  • Chief Kemosabe
                    Chief Kemosabe commented
                    Editing a comment
                    Just like every enlisted Male; regardless of MOS (probably soon to be female) to go through Infantry training school. With your officer training; perhaps you can try to go into the 13 series MOS (Artillery). With your O experience and some time in the NCO ranks, you probably can become a Warrant Officer. As a former Marine now Chief Warrant Officer for six years; it is the best decision I made. I have met some NG warrants at the school that I am in right now and those guys came back into the Army and in no time picked up Warrant. Just an option to consider. BTW, I was in the Army Guard before I switched to Regular Army and you should get some good experiences while serving in the Guard. I wish you the best.

                    Did you speak to your state's Officer Strength Manager (OSM) about the officer situation than NGB? If not; I would seek that person for some advice as well. You may get a different answer.

                  • Devildawgtiger
                    Devildawgtiger commented
                    Editing a comment
                    Yes, my initial contact three and a half years ago was with the OSM. I had done probably 100 hours of research reading Army and DOD pubs and told him I wouldn't be able to keep my commission. He insisted we go through the process and three and a half years later NGB finally said no dice.

                    I considered the 13 series, but the closest unit is four hours away. I have 19d forty five minutes away and 11b locally.

                    I'm definitely interested in the WO route. However, I know I need some enlisted time. Isn't 46 the age cutoff?

                • #11
                  Feel free to let the jokes fly now also.

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                  • realitycheck
                    realitycheck commented
                    Editing a comment
                    Being that Judge Advocates are a special branch, or in other words special commission in the Army as opposed to the Marine corps I am slightly thinking that you may be able to come in as a ARNG Judge Advocate. This is just a preliminary thought, and probably best answered by LTC Ritchie, but if you were a line officer (which in theory you are) and then become a judge advocate I believe you are technically "re commissioned" into the special branch. Engage LTC Ritchie and the state SJA you are trying to join. It is worth a shot. This is by no means gospel, just brainstorming.

                • #12
                  I've already been through the process of attempting to retain my commission. NGB says its a no go. Additionally, I have no interest in being a JAG. I practice law during the week. I don't want to do it on the weekends. I wanted a combat arms job. I really didn't care whether it was enlisted or officer.

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                  • realitycheck
                    realitycheck commented
                    Editing a comment
                    Fair enough. Good luck with it.

                • #13
                  Thanks. I appreciate the assistance.

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                  • realitycheck
                    realitycheck commented
                    Editing a comment
                    Another idea....you could enlist into MOS 27D, which is what I am, Legal Specialist, and then subsequently apply for MOS 270A legal administrator and be a warrant officer......unless you REALLY want to go blow stuff up.

                • #14
                  Yes, 46 is the age limit but I have seen Guardsman become WOs that were older and received age waivers. Problem now, is that the drawdown may hinder those age waiver approvals. But You can probably go for it in two years. Talk to the WOSM for those details.

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                  • #15
                    Roger that Chief. After I get (hopefully) a few good NCOERs, I'll engage my WOSM. Are there many WOs in the 19 series? Realitycheck, I really want to blow stuff up. I chose Marine JA over the other branches because it was the best compromise between getting the infantry type training I wanted and still getting to use my law degree. I was concerned if I joined a branch and didn't go JA (i.e., became and infantry officer, pilot, etc), that my law degree wouldn't be worth much when I got out. The Marines seemed to be the best of both worlds.

                    Comment


                    • realitycheck
                      realitycheck commented
                      Editing a comment
                      No. None. Th only warrants that are true combat arms are Special Forces 180A and Field Artillery Targeting Technician. 131A

                    • matthew.ritchie
                      matthew.ritchie commented
                      Editing a comment
                      Civilian-acquired skills have relevance for your WO application. If you have a law degree and some civilian legal experience, you may wish to discuss with your WOSM about becoming a legal affairs WO. Granted, the duty may lack the adventure you're seeking, although I still recommend having the conversation, so you know your status should your goals change in a few years.

                    • realitycheck
                      realitycheck commented
                      Editing a comment
                      Legal "Administrator".
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