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  • A brief moment on the Soap Box

    This is not a post to dash dreams or a statement about what is fair or not. As a prior service with an interest to get back to it, I have skimmed through the threads on this forum for a while now. What I do not understand is the potential/interested candidates that have questions, "I was charged...I was arrested...I was convicted.....can I get a clearance?...can I get in?" The reply post from subject matter experts provide the answer and often links to the regulation, yet the potential candidate doesn't accept it. Those interested in the military should:
    (1.) Realize that the total force is drawing down, the potential 'trigger' to the defense budget, and the economic situation.
    (2.) Research the positions/slots open in you state.
    (3.) Review the DA PAM for the qualifications for the MOS.
    (4.) Stay in tune with waivers, enlistment updates, and force structure changes in your state.
    (5.) Accept the information that you gather from this forum and apply it to your career path with the NG.
    Lastly, if you cannot get a waiver to enlist, you cannot get a security clearance.

  • #2
    Re: A brief moment on the Soap Box

    LTC Ritchie said it best "Contrary to popular belief, military enlistment is NOT a civil right."

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: A brief moment on the Soap Box

      I was already told by my recruiter that everything is good, he taped me 2 weeks ago and told me that I need to lose 3% body fat in order to join. I'm going back in for taping next month, if the recruiter says that my weight and measurements are good to join, could they say otherwise when I go to MEPS? Just not sure about that and I want to be 100% sure, I'm exercising daily and losing weight quickly; I'm going to push to lose much more weight/body fat than I was told to so that I won't be turned away.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: A brief moment on the Soap Box

        Yes, as your "official" physical takes place at MEPS. If you are accessed at 25% instead of 24% body fat than you may not pass.

        Keep in mind that your recruiter doesn't do this everyday and for a living so to speak. They just get you in the ballpark to be able to go to MEPS.

        Others will chime in to correct my post if it is inaccurate.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: A brief moment on the Soap Box

          ::CHIME::


          Just kidding. Carry on.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: A brief moment on the Soap Box

            Thanks, I'm striving to do my get and to get in my best shape (actually just got home from the gym).

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: A brief moment on the Soap Box

              (1.) Realize that the total force is drawing down, the potential 'trigger' to the defense budget, and the economic situation. True, but there are still positions to fill.
              (2.) Research the positions/slots open in you state. Only a RRNCO/OSM has this information
              (3.) Review the DA PAM for the qualifications for the MOS. This is done at MEPS.
              (4.) Stay in tune with waivers, enlistment updates, and force structure changes in your state. Just get a good recruiter, save yourself the agony of trying to be an expert.
              (5.) Accept the information that you gather from this forum and apply it to your career path with the NG.The forum is not a substitute for a RRNCO or OSM.
              Lastly, if you cannot get a waiver to enlist, you cannot get a security clearance. Not a true statement, the two are different processes and standards. For example you can get a waiver to enlist and not be eligible for clearance. For example a person has bad credit, therefore limiting their MOS options to those with without clearance. Or the circumstances of the case, is that the person needs a waiver but is eligible for clearance. Plus waiver is a wide term to include medical waiver, which is unrelated to the clearance process. Likewise you may not get a waiver to enlist but still could get a clearance, that is a small probability. For example, I have a secret clearance, but the Chief of Chaplain's office may not give me the waiver I need in order to become a full chaplain.
              Last edited by Chaplain4me; November 14th, 2012, 08:23 AM.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: A brief moment on the Soap Box

                Originally posted by Chaplain4me
                (5.) Accept the information that you gather from this forum and apply it to your career path with the NG.The forum is not a substitute for a RRNCO or OSM.Lastly, if you cannot get a waiver to enlist, you cannot get a security clearance. Not a true statement, the two are different processes and standards. For example you can get a waiver to enlist and not be eligible for clearance. For example a person has bad credit, therefore limiting their MOS options to those with without clearance. Or the circumstances of the case, is that the person needs a waiver but is eligible for clearance. Plus waiver is a wide term to include medical waiver, which is unrelated to the clearance process. Likewise you may not get a waiver to enlist but still could get a clearance, that is a small probability. For example, I have a secret clearance, but the Chief of Chaplain's office may not give me the waiver I need in order to become a full chaplain.
                You seem to discredit this forum a lot lately. It's an unspoken rule that what you hear on the internet may not always be true and every situation I have seen or dealt with on here, both parties (asking and answering) understand that situations vary.

                There is a difference between, "There are no more spots in the guard" and "total force is drawing down"
                A step in researching position/slots is asking a recruiter or osm.
                Anyone can download the DA PAM.
                You don't need a recruiter. You can come to the forums to stay up-to-date on information, whether you want to believe it or not.

                This forum is not full of recruiters but full of soldiers who want to help enlistees and retirees. Like I said, I'm sure everyone understands that situations vary, but you have to give the benfit of the doubt. 90% of the answers on here eventually end up with, "Go talk to a recruiter."

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: A brief moment on the Soap Box

                  Originally posted by Mr_Loki View Post
                  You seem to discredit this forum a lot lately. It's an unspoken rule that what you hear on the internet may not always be true and every situation I have seen or dealt with on here, both parties (asking and answering) understand that situations vary.

                  There is a difference between, "There are no more spots in the guard" and "total force is drawing down"
                  A step in researching position/slots is asking a recruiter or osm.
                  Anyone can download the DA PAM.
                  You don't need a recruiter. You can come to the forums to stay up-to-date on information, whether you want to believe it or not.

                  This forum is not full of recruiters but full of soldiers who want to help enlistees and retirees. Like I said, I'm sure everyone understands that situations vary, but you have to give the benfit of the doubt. 90% of the answers on here eventually end up with, "Go talk to a recruiter."
                  It would be nice to have some more recruiter presence. We did in the past. However, these forums are better than many other forums by a long shot. For example, www.armyocs.com has threads on its 1st page of its ARNG/USAR subforum that were last replied to more than a year ago! Talk about irrelevant and outdated information!

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: A brief moment on the Soap Box

                    They can force only so many people to be on here and post...you know as well as I do 99% of the people on here are because they want to be. This forum has a "no sharking" policy so recruiters don't steal potential recruits that are well out of their distance so most recruiters don't want to come here, not to mention they're busier with their own recruits.

                    Hopefully in the future, we will have identifying marks on users here that will let people know they're legit.
                    Last edited by Mr_Loki; November 14th, 2012, 01:35 PM. Reason: GRAMMAR!!!!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: A brief moment on the Soap Box

                      If it's a "subjective perception" then maybe you should assist the OP rather than discredit the members replying.

                      Why travel to a recruiter and ask him face to face if you can get in the National Guard with a domestic assault charge when you can anonymously do it on the internet?

                      Grain of salt and like I said, most answers end up as, "Go see a recruiter" anyways but if they wanted to go see a recruiter, they wouldn't be on here asking the question.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: A brief moment on the Soap Box

                        All it takes is a phone call.

                        Telling people that you can't get a security clearance if you need a waiver is not the truth, and bad advice. What if someone read what the OP wrote and thought, no use in talking to a recruiter. The Guard might have lost a potential soldier. Or to put it specifically into the OP thought, that if you can't get a waiver to enlist you cannot get a security clearance which isn't true. The potential for someone to not get a waiver but apply as a civilian for a clearance and get it is legit.

                        My post brought clarity to the subject.
                        Last edited by Chaplain4me; November 14th, 2012, 03:01 PM.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: A brief moment on the Soap Box

                          Originally posted by Chaplain4me View Post
                          (1.) Realize that the total force is drawing down, the potential 'trigger' to the defense budget, and the economic situation. True, but there are still positions to fill.
                          (2.) Research the positions/slots open in you state. Only a RRNCO/OSM has this information
                          (3.) Review the DA PAM for the qualifications for the MOS. This is done at MEPS.
                          (4.) Stay in tune with waivers, enlistment updates, and force structure changes in your state. Just get a good recruiter, save yourself the agony of trying to be an expert.
                          (5.) Accept the information that you gather from this forum and apply it to your career path with the NG.The forum is not a substitute for a RRNCO or OSM.
                          Lastly, if you cannot get a waiver to enlist, you cannot get a security clearance. Not a true statement, the two are different processes and standards. For example you can get a waiver to enlist and not be eligible for clearance. For example a person has bad credit, therefore limiting their MOS options to those with without clearance. Or the circumstances of the case, is that the person needs a waiver but is eligible for clearance. Plus waiver is a wide term to include medical waiver, which is unrelated to the clearance process. Likewise you may not get a waiver to enlist but still could get a clearance, that is a small probability. For example, I have a secret clearance, but the Chief of Chaplain's office may not give me the waiver I need in order to become a full chaplain.
                          An internet forum is a place that will foster discussion about a particular topic. It is the hope that, through discussion, a consensus will form. In most cases, a consensus will be more accurate than the average individual input. Sure, there are cases when a consensus is worse than an individual part, but this typically occurs in cases where the individuals are guessing randomly and do not possess the ability to answer correctly 50% of the time.

                          You make one faulty assumption: the recruiter or OSM is regarded as a SME, but may not necessarily be one. However, a recruiter will be a required step in the enlistment process.

                          If someone truly wants to enlist, we would hope they possess there wherewithal to utilize every resource possible (both recruiter and online information) to make a reasonable course of action.

                          As for security clearances, we do have an SME for that on this forum by the name of "shopstopper999". I believe his work is significantly involved in the clearance process (if he doesn't already work for the Army Central Clearance Facility).

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: A brief moment on the Soap Box

                            Originally posted by Chaplain4me View Post
                            All it takes is a phone call.

                            Telling people that you can't get a security clearance if you need a waiver is not the truth, and bad advice. What if someone read what the OP wrote and thought, no use in talking to a recruiter. The Guard might have lost a potential soldier. Or to put it specifically into the OP thought, that if you can't get a waiver to enlist you cannot get a security clearance which isn't true. The potential for someone to not get a waiver but apply as a civilian for a clearance and get it is legit.

                            My post brought clarity to the subject.

                            This is what he said, "Lastly, if you cannot get a waiver to enlist, you cannot get a security clearance."

                            Sounds to me he basically (and rhetorically) said if you need a waiver to enlist and can't get the waiver, you're obviously not going to get a clearance.
                            Last edited by Mr_Loki; November 14th, 2012, 03:38 PM.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: A brief moment on the Soap Box

                              Very lively discussion. I do not want to hinder it. (Mr_Loki understood my intent.)

                              Comment

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