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  • Correct career path?

    I'm prior service (Navy), considering recruitment into the National Quard. I'm intending on getting a ocs/special forces contract. I am currently in school, but should be completed with my BA in December. I'm hoping to be able to end my school, go to training, and return in time for grad school to start in Aug 2013.

    Near as I can tell, if I join, and ask my recruiter to send me to the schools back to back (and passed an assessment drill) it would look something like this:
    10 Weeks BCT
    12 Weeks OCS
    4 Weeks SFAS
    3-4 Weeks Jump school

    Leaving me a couple weeks before grad school started. After which I would go to BOLC B, MCCC, and SFQC. The first two would vary depending on my branch, and the last would be about 1 year.

    Is this about correct?

    I also hear of limits on what branches can go SF. If not SF/pre-SF I thinking Civil Affairs, which I hear there are also limits on.

    A lot of old or incorrect info seems to be out there, so I thought I would ask the source. Thank you.

  • #2
    Re: Correct career path?

    SF Hunter is often the subject matter expert here regarding SF information, although the nomenclature you used, "ocs/special forces contract" is not something that is offered as a "package".

    My advice is to take a deep breath and relax a little bit. (I can appreciate the desire to plan out life goals however, I do it myself).

    Once your degree is complete, assuming you meet all the other qualifying criteria BCT and Federal OCS can be performed sequentially. How long you have to wait to go is variable, but generally not more than 90 days after enlisting. As you seem to understand SF is a non-accession branch, and your initial basic branch selection is done differently in different states. Some allow some flexibility based on vacancies, some have a OML, some seem to pick arbirarily based on the needs of the Guard. Unless SF Hunter knows of some type of SFAS/Jump School Officer deal I've never heard of I don't know how you would attend a SFAS Course or Jump school before even being basic branch qualified. Your BOLC needs to start within 12 months of commissioning, and for basic branches other than aviation lasts 15 - 20 weeks. You wrote Manuver Captain's Career Course, which is for senior Infantry Lieutenants and Captains....some officers start some portion of their CCC within 2-3 years of commissioning, and some don't start it till a few years later. Civil Affairs is ALSO a non-accession branch.
    SF Hunter can advise more on this but SF Officer Requirements include:

    The U.S. Army Recruiting Command recruits officers as SF volunteers. Officers are accessed upon selection for promotion to captain. Normally they complete all training and reach their first operational assignment two years later. Over 400 officers typically apply each year. Of the 400 applicants, approximately 155 successfully graduate SFDOQC and branch transfer into SF. The accessions window for applicants is the ARSOF Officer Accessions Board, which follows the captain's promotion board.

    c. SF officer training prerequisites. Officers applying for selection for SF training will meet the following prerequisites:

    (1) Be an Active Army male Soldier.

    (2) Be in their third year of active federal commissioned service when the SF accession board meets (Active Army only).

    (3) Be a captain or be selected for promotion to captain.

    (4) Have enough time remaining as a captain to complete SF training and serve a minimum of three years in a SF unit before DA centralized selection board consideration in the primary zone for promotion to major. This allows for the completion of key development assignments and attainment of sufficient SF experience before selection for major.

    (5) Be airborne qualified. If not airborne qualified, the applicant must volunteer for airborne training.

    (6) Have passed the APFT in his age category, with a minimum of 240 points overall, 60 points minimum per event.

    (7) Be able to swim 50 meters unassisted while wearing the full Army combat uniform with boots.

    (8) Have scored at least 85 on the Defense Language Aptitude Battery (DLAB) or have met USAJFKSWCS language school graduation standards on the DLPT in a SF-required language (other than English).

    (9) Have met the medical standards for SF training per AR 40-501 , Standards of Medical Fitness.

    (10) Have a secret security clearance and be eligible for a top secret security clearance.

    (11) Be a resident MCCC graduate by the time of enrollment in the SFDOQC. Normally, officers will attend the Special Forces Assessment and Selection (SFAS) before resident MCCC attendance.

    Civil Affairs Requirements include:
    c. Accession. The CA Branch is a non-accession branch. Of the following criteria, requirements 19-3 c (1) through (8) will not be waived. Officers selected for branch transfer must —

    (1) Complete a resident Basic Officer Leader Course (BOLC).

    (2) Complete a Basic Branch Officer CCC.

    (3) Complete CAQC.

    (4) Be assigned to a valid entry-level CA 38A position.

    (5) Possess a bachelor's degree.

    (6) Possess a valid secret security clearance. Active Army officers must be eligible for a top secret clearance in accordance with AR 600-4 .

    (7) Attain a minimum score of 85 on the Defense Language Aptitude Battery (DLAB) or a DLPT score of 1/1/1 or higher (Active Army only).

    (8) Be airborne qualified or medically and physically capable and willing to volunteer for airborne training (Active Army only). Active Army officers will not start CAQC until they successfully complete Airborne training.

    (9) Possess a physical profile of 111221 (exception to policy outlined in paragraph 19-3 g ).

    (10) Attain the rank of first lieutenant or captain (exception to policy outlined in paragraph 19-3 g ).

    d. Desired qualifications. Because of the regional orientation of U.S. Army CA units, a foreign language skill and regional or cultural expertise is highly desirable. Officers must have an aptitude for learning a foreign language and must sustain foreign-language proficiency throughout their careers. In addition, advanced civilian education and a strong background in one of the civilian-acquired functional specialties are desirable.

    e. Opportunities for female Soldiers. All branch 38-coded positions are open to women, including all positions in CA units and command positions, except for DCPC 1 positions in SF groups and the Ranger Regiment.

    I'm sorry for the cut and paste regulation but it seemed important. Good luck.
    Last edited by Mongoose772; July 6th, 2012, 09:22 PM.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Correct career path?

      Originally posted by RTH View Post
      I'm prior service (Navy), considering recruitment into the National Quard. I'm intending on getting a ocs/special forces contract. I am currently in school, but should be completed with my BA in December. I'm hoping to be able to end my school, go to training, and return in time for grad school to start in Aug 2013.

      Near as I can tell, if I join, and ask my recruiter to send me to the schools back to back (and passed an assessment drill) it would look something like this:
      10 Weeks BCT
      12 Weeks OCS
      4 Weeks SFAS

      3-4 Weeks Jump school

      Leaving me a couple weeks before grad school started. After which I would go to BOLC B, MCCC, and SFQC. The first two would vary depending on my branch, and the last would be about 1 year.

      Is this about correct?

      I also hear of limits on what branches can go SF. If not SF/pre-SF I thinking Civil Affairs, which I hear there are also limits on.

      A lot of old or incorrect info seems to be out there, so I thought I would ask the source. Thank you.
      That is extremely unlikely.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Correct career path?

        I understand that having a SF in your recruitment contract only gives you the opportunity to try for special forces; it does not guarantee Q school. I've seen nothing to imply that a 18x and OCS enlistment options were mutually exclusive.

        according to this source, CCC is normally completed after SFAS: http://www.nationalguard.com/careers...special-forces

        10. Must be a resident MCCC graduate, by the time of enrollment in the Special Forces Detachment Officer Qualification Course (SFDOQC). Normally, officers will attend the Special Forces Assessment and Selection (SFAS) before resident MCCC attendance.
        I believe the intent is to screen the wash-outs. I am listing SFAS as a pre-req for Q school, not as a first stage of SF training. If passed, it would nearly cement my future attendance in Q school, though I would still need to go to BOLC B, and wouldn't be attending Q until rank eligible. As I understand it.

        So far as branch is concerned, it's very real I may not have a large choice per the needs of the Guard; or so I have read. I may be interested in Adjutant General, but information on their training is also fuzzy; I think BOLC B is 9 weeks.

        If I replaced SFAS and Jump school with those 9 weeks, i would still be in schedule, and at least would have my branch designation for promotion's sake.

        If I arrange my first training block like this:
        10 Weeks Basic
        12 Weeks OCS
        9 Weeks AG BOLC-B

        does anyone see any obvious problems?

        Part of my concern is this: I am currently 30 years old, and even with my prior service (4 years), if i stand and wait for 5 years to make captain I may lose my qualification.

        [tried to post this before. waited 36 hours, haven't seen it, reposting]

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Correct career path?

          Originally posted by RTH View Post
          I'm prior service (Navy), considering recruitment into the National Quard. I'm intending on getting a ocs/special forces contract. I am currently in school, but should be completed with my BA in December. I'm hoping to be able to end my school, go to training, and return in time for grad school to start in Aug 2013.

          Near as I can tell, if I join, and ask my recruiter to send me to the schools back to back (and passed an assessment drill) it would look something like this:
          10 Weeks BCT
          12 Weeks OCS
          4 Weeks SFAS
          3-4 Weeks Jump school

          Leaving me a couple weeks before grad school started. After which I would go to BOLC B, MCCC, and SFQC. The first two would vary depending on my branch, and the last would be about 1 year.

          Is this about correct?

          I also hear of limits on what branches can go SF. If not SF/pre-SF I thinking Civil Affairs, which I hear there are also limits on.

          A lot of old or incorrect info seems to be out there, so I thought I would ask the source. Thank you.
          This is not the way it works at all. You cannot have Special Forces in an enlistment contract for OCS/officer career path.

          You will first have to enlist* for OCS (09S), attend BCT (if required), OCS and then your selected Basic Officer Branch training, preferably Combat Arms branch (ie Infantry, Artillery, etc).
          *USN personnel (including Reserve components) who have not completed Army or Marine Corps Basic Training will be required to attend Army Basic Combat Training (BCT). The only exceptions are PS USN Special Operations (SPECOPS) personnel.

          Attain the rank of at least 1LT/O-2 with successful branch assignments and evaluation reports.
          Meet all the officer requirements: http://www.nationalguard.com/forums/...s-Requirements

          Then you can apply for Special Forces with an Guard SF unit that is accepting officer applicants.

          If you successfully pass the unit's SFRE/SFAD. If accepted, then you will be scheduled for and attend SFAS. If you are selected at SFAS, then you will attend the remaining required training for Special Forces. Please see training time-line thread for officers.

          As for certain branches that usually will not allow applications for Special Forces: JAG, Chaplain, AMEDD and Aviation. Depending on critical need, sometimes Signal and MI branches will not release their officers.
          Last edited by SF Hunter; February 12th, 2013, 06:13 PM.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Correct career path?

            Originally posted by RTH View Post
            If I replaced SFAS and Jump school with those 9 weeks, i would still be in schedule, and at least would have my branch designation for promotion's sake.

            If I arrange my first training block like this:
            10 Weeks Basic
            12 Weeks OCS
            9 Weeks AG BOLC-B

            does anyone see any obvious problems?
            Yes. In addition to what SF Hunter has said, you cannot count on being sent to federal OCS. Your state's RTI (regional training institute) will determine which OCS program you will attend. Even if you go federal, you may have to wait several months before you ship out.

            You may wind up having to do the traditional OCS program, which is done in a reserve status and takes 1-2 years (depending on when you are assigned to the RTI). This is the default option so you should assume that this is the path you will take, and hope that you'll have the opportunity to attend either NGB accelerated OCS (8 weeks) or federal OCS (12 weeks). Speaking only from my experience, if your RTI clears you to attend a non-traditional OCS program, you will probably go to the NGB accelerated course (I did).

            As for whether or not you'll be cleared to attend a non-traditional OCS program, this decision is in the hands of a few individuals (TAC officers and NCOs) who may or may not be fair, rational, and/or competent. In my case, they were none of the foregoing. I had to involve the IG in order to get my orders for accelerated OCS.

            Regardless, at this stage of the game, you should be focused on getting through BCT first. Then figure out OCS. After you've attended BOLC and whatever follow-on schools your state will pay for (if any), worry about being a good platoon leader. That's when you should start thinking about SF.

            Good luck.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Correct career path?

              Originally posted by jwarren View Post
              Yes. In addition to what SF Hunter has said, you cannot count on being sent to federal OCS. Your state's RTI (regional training institute) will determine which OCS program you will attend. Even if you go federal, you may have to wait several months before you ship out.

              You may wind up having to do the traditional OCS program, which is done in a reserve status and takes 1-2 years (depending on when you are assigned to the RTI). This is the default option so you should assume that this is the path you will take, and hope that you'll have the opportunity to attend either NGB accelerated OCS (8 weeks) or federal OCS (12 weeks). Speaking only from my experience, if your RTI clears you to attend a non-traditional OCS program, you will probably go to the NGB accelerated course (I did).

              As for whether or not you'll be cleared to attend a non-traditional OCS program, this decision is in the hands of a few individuals (TAC officers and NCOs) who may or may not be fair, rational, and/or competent. In my case, they were none of the foregoing. I had to involve the IG in order to get my orders for accelerated OCS.

              Regardless, at this stage of the game, you should be focused on getting through BCT first. Then figure out OCS. After you've attended BOLC and whatever follow-on schools your state will pay for (if any), worry about being a good platoon leader. That's when you should start thinking about SF.

              Good luck.
              Likewise.

              Historically speaking, a very sizable number of candidates who went to AOCS from New Jersey was due to the involvement from the IG, EO, and/or Congressional offices. We're not shy about pointing this out.

              You have to be blessed by an angel to get everything your way, RTH.
              Last edited by Polo08816; July 10th, 2012, 08:01 PM.

              Comment

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