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  • #61
    Re: Afghanistan

    Originally posted by beckstcw
    I sure hope not.
    I was just kidding around earlier with that but yeah dude I'm with you I hope and pray to God that it doesn't happen.

    Comment


    • #62
      Re: Afghanistan

      Originally posted by SGT Bart
      that happens in every war were in, but I'm sure you know that. I'm also sure you know why they do this. I'm sure.
      It doesn't take much to figure that one out. Afghanistan is the world's third poorest country, no electricity, but plenty of ordinance.

      The russian lob b omb is one example.....someone is fighting a proxy war.

      Comment


      • #63
        Re: Afghanistan

        Originally posted by PFC Nothstein
        they own a lot of our big national parks and stuff. how crazy is that?
        I find that a little doubtful.

        Snopes gave me this link:

        http://www.snopes.com/politics/business/domain.asp

        Great website btw.

        As for Afghanistan, I'd guess we won't be there past 3-5 more years max if things don't settle down. If things become stable enough then we'll probably have bases there forever. If we're there into the next election year, withdrawal will certainly be one of the major issues with voters.

        Comment


        • #64
          Re: Afghanistan

          Originally posted by M-T
          If things become stable enough then we'll probably have bases there forever.
          I don't even want that to happen.

          Comment


          • #65
            Re: Afghanistan

            Originally posted by RandyB
            Afghanistan isn't Iraq, many have tried to tame astan, none have succeded. We will leave like the Russians before us and the British before that.

            Times are differen't, mass casualities are not acceptable and this is an all volunteer army. You can lose more with a draftee army and still have men, we only have a limited number of americans willing to enlist. No one will enlist if they know they will most likely die.
            I will let this one slide this time.

            Soon you will discover that the Army always fights for victory. Whether that victory takes one year or twenty years.

            The Army will go the distance, and is totally perpared for that. You shall soon figure this out.

            There is only one option victory, a stable, Islamic Republic of Afghanistan

            See the Army doesn't operate on the premise of public opinion.

            The Army serves it's civilian leadership.

            Soon you'll figure this out......you're still in civilian mode.
            Last edited by Chaplain4me; July 18th, 2010, 08:33 PM.

            Comment


            • #66
              Re: Afghanistan

              Originally posted by Chaplain4me
              I will let this one slide this time.

              Soon you will discover that the Army always fights for victory. Whether that victory takes one year or twenty years.

              The Army will go the distance, and is totally perpared for that. You shall soon figure this out.

              There is only one option victory, a stable, Islamic Republic of Afghanistan

              See the Army doesn't operate on the premise of public opinion.

              The Army serves it's civilian leadership.

              Soon you'll figure this out......you're still in civilian mode.
              I donno about that one Sir .. I've served in A-Stan as an 11b so I'd imagine I've seen the war for what it is .. for one the Army completely operates on the premise of public opinion, it was a running joke over there that "COIN KILLS" .. the people believe the Taliban to be morally and religiously superior to the Government, that is based in fact from the public debrief the former CO of TF Mountain Warrior gave when 4/4 left the country .. to be honest I don't see us going the distance here, cause no matter how many radios we give out the bulk of the people won't support us or each other for that matter .. the country is too tribalized and unconnected .. I really do hope something positive turns out for Afghanistan cause it is an amazing place, I just don't see it happening.

              Comment


              • #67
                Re: Afghanistan

                Originally posted by CaseyJones
                no matter how many radios we give out the bulk of the people won't support us or each other for that matter .. the country is too tribalized and unconnected .. I really do hope something positive turns out for Afghanistan cause it is an amazing place, I just don't see it happening.
                Good post.

                Yeah, for all the chest beating about how great our Army is, the side with the better military is not always the one that stands as the victor in the end. If you're in a foreign land and your goal is to leave behind a democratic, stable land, the actual inhabitants of that land have a lot to say about whether or not you win. Pretending otherwise just gets us in a quagmire. Plenty of great countries have made that same oversight to the loss of a lot of years and lot of men in a lot of foreign wars.

                Comment


                • #68
                  Re: Afghanistan

                  Originally posted by notyetdead
                  Good post.

                  Yeah, for all the chest beating about how great our Army is, the side with the better military is not always the one that stands as the victor in the end. If you're in a foreign land and your goal is to leave behind a democratic, stable land, the actual inhabitants of that land have a lot to say about whether or not you win. Pretending otherwise just gets us in a quagmire. Plenty of great countries have made that same oversight to the loss of a lot of years and lot of men in a lot of foreign wars.
                  If this was like facebook I would click the like button

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    Re: Afghanistan

                    I'm glad you all are not Field Grade strategists.

                    If the nations defense relied on that type of mentality, we would have went under long ago. Just put up the white flag and go home.

                    Not to say what you did there wasn't significant, I hope to be there myself in 2011.

                    There is a difference between Strategic, Operational, and Tactical levels.

                    But be sure of this all possible avenues have been thought out. I have good faith in the strategic plans of our superiors. All is not in vain.

                    Comment


                    • #70
                      Re: Afghanistan

                      Originally posted by Casey Jones
                      I donno about that one Sir .. I've served in A-Stan as an 11b so I'd imagine I've seen the war for what it is .. for one the Army completely operates on the premise of public opinion, it was a running joke over there that "COIN KILLS" .. the people believe the Taliban to be morally and religiously superior to the Government, that is based in fact from the public debrief the former CO of TF Mountain Warrior gave when 4/4 left the country .. to be honest I don't see us going the distance here, cause no matter how many radios we give out the bulk of the people won't support us or each other for that matter .. the country is too tribalized and unconnected .. I really do hope something positive turns out for Afghanistan cause it is an amazing place, I just don't see it happening.
                      Originally posted by notyetdead
                      Good post.

                      Yeah, for all the chest beating about how great our Army is, the side with the better military is not always the one that stands as the victor in the end. If you're in a foreign land and your goal is to leave behind a democratic, stable land, the actual inhabitants of that land have a lot to say about whether or not you win. Pretending otherwise just gets us in a quagmire. Plenty of great countries have made that same oversight to the loss of a lot of years and lot of men in a lot of foreign wars.
                      The issue with what you are syaing is that it isn't the Army's responsibility to create the government. Our goal is to create a level of security IOT transition to stability ops. Then the Gov Agencies and NGOs take over. COIN doesn't ****. It's the transition that gets you. Once the HN government gains some legitimacy in its people's eyes the violence should die down as the people work to improve their country. With A-stan it is difficult because there has never been a strong central govt, but they are free to pick the model that works for them. Tribal and decentralized doesn't have to equal unstable.

                      Not to get into the way back machine but RandyB's comparison to the Russians is way off. The strategy/tactics used by the Red Army were nothing like what we are doing.

                      Edited to add: Really, I can't type k i l l on an Army recruiting site, but kills is ok? As long as the departed number more than one I guess.
                      Last edited by cyall; July 19th, 2010, 03:25 PM.

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        Re: Afghanistan

                        Originally posted by cyall
                        Once the HN government gains some legitimacy in its people's eyes the violence should die down as the people work to improve their country.
                        There's the major trouble.. it's once or if. It's going to be an issue if we just prop up a leader that no one supports. From my limited study I'd say it's a shame we don't have someone like Ahmad Shah Massoud or a leader to galvanize the Afghans without turning them against the US.

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          Re: Afghanistan

                          Recently, I've been thinking about where I was on 9/11.

                          I remember that day well. I speak the truth.

                          That morning I got ready for work. I was working at an ACE hardware. I had put on my redshirt. Something told me to pray for this nation. I took my chair and sat it in the middle of my room and prayed for America.

                          I went to the store, just a block or two away. Pretty typical morning. Mess with the paint machine. Front, some items and what not. Help a few customers. I flirted a lot with this one cashier.

                          I was building a display, when my manager, a man who helped me through troubled times and led me to Jesus, came by and said a plane has hit the world trade center. I thought well that's probably a mistake or something. So I carried on with my business. Sometime had passed and my manager came back and said, another plane has hit the world trade center, we are under attack. Initally, I was confused. Then I felt angry. Asking myself all those questions, who? what? and so on.

                          I remember after it had happend, we couldn't sell enough American Flags.

                          Now, in my state we have a brigade chaplain, who is the fire department chaplain for Oklahoma City. One reason I say Oklahoma has the finest chaplain corps. He was the chaplain for the FD during the oklahoma city b ombing. He's told how these events continue to affect people long after the fact. Not only does it affect the people involved but their familes and anyone asscociated with them. No one lives unto themselves. He told us about what he saw. He told us how they removed the bodies from the debris. The pain lingers.

                          Just thought I'd share with you what was on my mind.

                          Comment


                          • #73
                            Re: Afghanistan

                            If you don't see something as valuble then you will not fight for it. I'm not going to fight over used toilet paper. I may fight if someone tries and take my car. I will for sure fight if my family is threatened.

                            2001 is a long time ago. For some of these young soldiers, it started when they were nine years old. For me that's difficult to think upon. Did they even know what was happening at the time?

                            Just like my sermons I'm now rambling.

                            Comment


                            • #74
                              Re: Afghanistan

                              I remember very clearly where I was that day

                              Comment


                              • #75
                                Re: Afghanistan

                                Originally posted by Chaplain4me
                                Recently, I've been thinking about where I was on 9/11.

                                I remember that day well. I speak the truth.

                                That morning I got ready for work. I was working at an ACE hardware. I had put on my redshirt. Something told me to pray for this nation. I took my chair and sat it in the middle of my room and prayed for America.

                                I went to the store, just a block or two away. Pretty typical morning. Mess with the paint machine. Front, some items and what not. Help a few customers. I flirted a lot with this one cashier.

                                I was building a display, when my manager, a man who helped me through troubled times and led me to Jesus, came by and said a plane has hit the world trade center. I thought well that's probably a mistake or something. So I carried on with my business. Sometime had passed and my manager came back and said, another plane has hit the world trade center, we are under attack. Initally, I was confused. Then I felt angry. Asking myself all those questions, who? what? and so on.

                                I remember after it had happend, we couldn't sell enough American Flags.

                                Now, in my state we have a brigade chaplain, who is the fire department chaplain for Oklahoma City. One reason I say Oklahoma has the finest chaplain corps. He was the chaplain for the FD during the oklahoma city b ombing. He's told how these events continue to affect people long after the fact. Not only does it affect the people involved but their familes and anyone asscociated with them. No one lives unto themselves. He told us about what he saw. He told us how they removed the bodies from the debris. The pain lingers.

                                Just thought I'd share with you what was on my mind.
                                Really good post.

                                I remember both instances. I was very young when the OKC bombing happened, but i heard it. 50 miles away, in Chandler, Oklahoma. I had just turned 2. i was young, but i remember very clearly it happening.

                                I also remember 9/11. i was sitting in my 3rd grade class, and they came over the intercom saying what had happened.

                                I know very clearly what i'm fighting for, and why i want to. as i hope everyone does.

                                Alex

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