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Craziest administrative reduction or long rank retention that you've seen?

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  • Craziest administrative reduction or long rank retention that you've seen?

    During mobilization a few years ago I saw some crazy ones:

    -CPT to SGT. Former ODA CDR (SF team) deployed as a SGT. He had resigned his commission in the 90's and wanted a piece of the action once OIF started up.

    -MAJ to SGT. Career Guardsman, somehow was promoted through the officer ranks, but never met some basic requirement to retain state or federal commission.

    -SPC to SPC. After what I assume was a long break in service, a RVN vet who was a Spec-4 in that war happened to get deployed for OIF as a SPC.

    -PFC retirement. I don't know how it happened, but at BDE S1 I saw a retirement certificate for a PFC.

    And then there are the stereotypical Guard bums who are happy as junior enlisted and stay a PFC or SPC for over a decade.

  • #2
    Hey S**T happens. Nothing that happened to a warrant? No General to Private reduction?

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    • #3
      I just meant non-judicial reductions. I know there have been LTG to PV1 reductions made before!

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      • #4
        There is a CW2 at state that was a MAJ. I believe he was a Tech, and somehow his type of position was being converted to AGR, he wanted to stay on the tech (state) side of the house and work those benefits etc...so he resigned his commish and went the WO route. :eek:

        Last year we had an E7 that was walking around with a camera, taking pics of everything and following our BDE CDR around. He was being very dangerous, trying to get in front of the .50 cal firing line to take pics etc, when our CO blasted him he was saying "well, I used to be a captain" like anyone cared.

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        • #5
          I don't know the details on what happened, but I know a nurse who was a LTC in the ARNG and somehow got non-retained after 16 years of service. She is now an E5 on the air side to finish out her retirement.

          Seemed weird to me, but I'm still a n00b about these things...:confused:

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          • #6
            I am currently seeing the same thing. A LTC nonselect coming back as a E6. Seems like a huge life change.

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            • #7
              Im just glad my recruiter didn't get his rank taken away after his goofy self got the portable rockwall stuck in a carwash...........he does things like that............its normal.........JUST KIDDING SGT!!!!!!!!

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              • #8
                [QUOTE=QuantumRN]I don't know the details on what happened, but I know a nurse who was a LTC in the ARNG and somehow got non-retained after 16 years of service. She is now an E5 on the air side to finish out her retirement.

                Seemed weird to me, but I'm still a n00b about these things...:confused:[/QUOTE]

                Well she will get her top grade for retirement right? (if she held the rank for 3 years?)

                Comment


                • #9
                  [quote=LT_77]There is a CW2 at state that was a MAJ. I believe he was a Tech, and somehow his type of position was being converted to AGR, he wanted to stay on the tech (state) side of the house and work those benefits etc...so he resigned his commish and went the WO route. :eek:
                  [/quote]

                  CW2-CW5 are "Commissioned" Warrant Officers ;) And I doubt he was reduced to WO1. If you were an E-7 in the Guard and go the Warrant route, when you graduate WOCS and return to your unit, you are promoted to CW2.
                  Last edited by WO1 Quinones; October 20th, 2008, 02:03 PM.

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                  • #10
                    Court-Martials

                    [B]Colonel paternity tangle[/B]
                    [B]Army War College O-6s linked in DNA test switch[/B]

                    By Brendan McGarry
                    bmcgarr [COLOR=#0000ff]y@militar[/COLOR] [URL="http://ytimes.com/"][COLOR=#0000ff]ytimes.com[/COLOR][/URL]
                    When they first met in the sum­mer of 1997, he was a major; she was a specialist.
                    He was the executive officer of the 240th Quartermaster Battal­ion at Fort Lee, Va. She was a communications specialist in the security and operations office.
                    Greetings in the hallway be­came long conversations in his office. Both were married with children.
                    “Eventually, we did kiss after work hours,” she said. “Eventual­ly, we agreed to meet.” So began the affair and eventu­al paternity dispute involving for­mer Col. Scott M. Carlson and the woman, as she recalled the story. She agreed to be inter­viewed by Army Times on the condition that her name be with­held to protect the identity of their 10-year-old daughter.
                    Carlson, a 2007 graduate of the prestigious Army War College, was convicted in September by a jury in Cumberland County, Pa., on charges related to arranging for a classmate at the college — a colonel later assigned to the Of­ fice of the Assistant Secretary of Defense for Homeland Defense — to take a paternity test for him.
                    Now, the two could face jail time.
                    Carlson, 52, who retired only weeks before the jury’s decision, is to be sentenced Dec. 30.
                    “It was more disappointing to me that someone with this level of experience and education would do this,” said Derek R. Clepper, senior assistant district attorney in the Cumberland County District Attorney’s Office and the prosecutor in the case.
                    The classmate, Col. Bruce S. Adkins, 47, is to stand trial Nov. 22 on similar charges, including felony criminal conspiracy for tampering with the public record or information. A reservist, Ad­ kins’ retirement is pending the outcome of the case, said his at­torney, Greg Abeln.
                    Clepper said of Carlson and Ad­kins, “I don’t understand how they got so far along in their career.” Carlson’s attorney, Dennis Boyle, said Carlson denied ask­ing Adkins to take the test.
                    “We do believe there are good grounds for appeal,” Boyle said.
                    The affair
                    The former specialist said she and Carlson began an affair in November 1997 that lasted through the summer of 2000.
                    She was married at the time with three children. He was mar­ried with a daughter, who is now serving in Iraq with the Marine Corps, Boyle said.
                    Boyle said Carlson denied hav­ing a physical relationship with the specialist after the baby was born on Aug. 25, 1998.
                    At first, the specialist didn’t think the baby was Carlson’s.
                    Her husband’s name was ini­tially listed on the birth certifi­cate, but a DNA test adminis­tered later that year excluded the man from paternity of the child.
                    In 1999, she and her husband divorced. The same year, she left the Army.
                    Meanwhile, Carlson continued to advance in his career with overseas assignments in Bahrain and Egypt.
                    “Every year, I was like, ‘Can you sign her birth certificate?’ ” she said. “There was always a reason why he couldn’t.”
                    The dispute
                    The former specialist said she re­ceived her first monthly child sup­port payment from Carlson for $50 in August 2000. He states in a let­ter presented as evidence in the case he began paying child support as far back as January 1999. Re­gardless of when payments began, both sides agree Carlson paid child support for several years.
                    The payments — allotments from Carlson’s military pay sometimes augmented with money orders — increased until late 2006, the woman said.
                    She said that in May or June of that year, facing rising child care costs, she asked Carlson to raise the monthly allotment from $400 to $600. “He said that money was tight. He was going to get some kind of raise in October,” she said. “I said, ‘Fine.’ There was a level of trust there.” In October, Carlson, then en­rolled as a student at the Army War College at the Carlisle Bar­racks, Pa. — the Army’s premiere leadership school — was promot­ed to colonel. But November came with no change in allotment, the former specialist said. She said she decided she had had enough.
                    “I said, ‘That’s it. I’ve given him the benefit of the doubt. ... We’re going to establish paternity and put a court order in place.’ ” In December 2006, she sued for increased child support. On Dec. 29, she said she received a one­time payment of $600 from Carl­son, then nothing.
                    “He got word of [the complaint] and he immediately stopped the allotment,” Clepper said.
                    Boyle, Carlson’s attorney, said Carlson made payments totaling $1,050 that month and “only stopped paying child support be­cause Cumberland County told him to stop until the actual amount [owed] was calculated.” Carlson was eventually ordered to pay $991 a month in child sup­port and more than $11,000 in back payments — which he did. But not before he enlisted the help of a classmate at the college to try to cheat a paternity test, Clepper said.
                    The other colonel
                    In an interview with authori­ties, Bruce Adkins said he met Carlson shortly after arriving at the Army War College. The two bowled together on post and, on occasion, went out drinking so­cially, he said.
                    Adkins was one of 20 reservists selected as part of the 338-student resident class of 2007, according to information provided by the col­lege. There is no tuition at the school, as the academic program is considered training sponsored by the Army. The annual academic operating budget is $2.4 million, according to the college.
                    According to a transcript of his interview with investigators, Ad­kins said he suffered a stroke in December 2006 that affected his mobility and memory. He said he struggled with school and that Carlson volunteered to help him with his schoolwork.
                    In early 2007, Adkins said Carl­son told him about the affair, which was described as a one­time encounter at a bachelor party that took place while Carl­son and his wife were separated. After repeated requests from Carlson, Adkins said he agreed to take the paternity test, according to the interview.
                    “I ... got a ... [paternity] test for him because he thought he had impregnated another woman,” Adkins told investigators.
                    “He said, ‘You know, I just can’t have my marriage destroyed.’ “He said that he’s 98 percent sure [he’s not the father], but it’s better to be 100 [percent],” Adkins said, according to the interview.
                    Adkins said he later realized it was a mistake, but that he felt a sense of loyalty to Carlson.
                    “I came from Washington, D.C., and I didn’t make colonel by being disloyal to people,” he said.
                    On April 24, 2007 — a month after Carlson visited the Cumber­land County Domestic Relations Office to schedule the paternity test — Adkins appeared in the same office with Carlson’s driver ’s license, presented himself as Carl­son and submitted an oral swab for the DNA sample, Clepper said. Office workers weren’t convinced the man was Carlson, but they administered the test neverthe­less, Clepper said. Adkins smiled for the camera and pressed his thumbprint on the paperwork, ac­cording to copies of the documents filed as evidence in the case.
                    To confirm his identity, the of­fice sent a photograph of Adkins to the former specialist, who now lives in Virginia and works as a computer technician. She said she took one look at the photograph and immediately contacted au­thorities to report that the indi­vidual in the picture was not Carlson.
                    When asked to describe her re­action to the photograph, she said, “Complete shock.” “Not many kids can say, ‘My dad tried to fake a paternity test,’ ” she said.
                    The district attorney’s office for­warded a copy of the man’s thumbprint to the Federal Bu­reau of Investigation’s Criminal Justice Information Service Spe­cial Processing Section in Clarks­burg, W.Va. The print was identi­fied as Adkins’, according to Clep­per.
                    ‘Who’s your daddy?’
                    Clepper said Adkins talked about his role after being contact­ed by authorities. But he said Ad­kins testified in court that he told his wife about what he had done after the couple ran into Carlson while leaving the college.
                    “Bruce Adkins was putting gas in the car with his wife in the car. Scott Carlson passed by and said, ‘Who’s your daddy, Bruce?’ Bruce Adkins’ wife said, ‘What was that about?’ That’s when he confessed to his wife what he had done,” Clepper said.
                    Carlson’s attorney, Boyle, reject­ed that characterization of events. “My client denied that completely,” he said. “He had no idea what he was talking about.” Boyle said Carlson acknowl­edged during his testimony that he was the father of the child and was honest about the affair with his wife and the Army.
                    When asked by Army Times how Adkins obtained Carlson’s li­cense, or why Adkins would have taken the paternity test on his own accord, Boyle said, “Neither [my client] nor I have an explana­tion as to why Adkins would have done this.” Abeln, the attorney represent­ing Adkins, said Adkins spoke to authorities without a plea deal.


                    YOU HAVE TO GO TO [URL="http://www.ARMYTIMES.COM"]WWW.ARMYTIMES.COM[/URL] FOR THE WHOLE STORY

                    [IMG]http://armytimes.va.newsmemory.com/newsmemvol2/virginia/armytimes/20081027/1027_arm_dom_00_008_00.pdf.0/img/Image_1.jpg[/IMG]
                    Carlson

                    [IMG]http://armytimes.va.newsmemory.com/newsmemvol2/virginia/armytimes/20081027/1027_arm_dom_00_008_00.pdf.0/img/Image_0.jpg[/IMG]

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                    • #11
                      I know a former active duty Navy O-3 who was promoted to O-4 in the reserves who is now a CW2 in the ARNG. No punitive action, just an 8 to 9 year gap in service.
                      Last edited by RobLyman; October 21st, 2008, 09:18 PM.

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                      • #12
                        The E7 we called "Sir"

                        I was in Honduras and noticed that everyone was calling this SFC "Sir". When I asked someone about it, they said he was an O6 who decided he had gone far enough in his career and was tired of being so far removed from the troops...so he resigned his commission and is doing what he loves...

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                        • #13
                          I must be a "Guard Bum" as stated earlier. When I got out of the Guard in 1998 I was put out as an E-2 though I was an E-4. Currently trying to figure that one out. NO I was not an Awol or problem soldier. Recruiter told me he would put me back in as PFC. So I will be 4 yrs 8 months and 23 days and a PFC. Well at least I will be back in.
                          Last edited by priorserv2; October 20th, 2008, 07:07 PM.

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                          • #14
                            1. I had a former colleague who enlisted in the active component in the 1980s. He came to the Guard, completed OCS, and later got promoted to 1LT. He realized that no one trusted him to go any higher, so he became a WO. Then he never completed WOBC, and completed his career as an E5. He went full circle in 20 years. I guess he retired as a first lieutenant.
                            2. I had another colleague who was a 1LT for about eight years. We had captains with less time in service than he had time in grade. Basically, he refused to complete his degree, and you can't make captain without a degree.
                            3. I had yet another colleague with the same basic situation as above, but because he had made captain literally days before the ROPMA law took effect (which made a degree a prerequisite for captain), he was grandfathered ... to a certain extent. He was DA selected for major, but couldn't pin on, because he lacked the degree. He got a voluntary delay, then another delay, then an extension, and then finally after ten years as a captain (and the dubious distinction of being the most senior captain in the entire US Army at one point) tried to finish his degree. He asked for another year's extension, but the general refused to approve, since he had made so little progress over the past ten years. He had over 20 total years, so he retired.
                            4. I brought in a US Navy lieutenant (O3) to the Guard. He was a Tomcat F14 pilot. We don't have those, but we got him reclassified as an Air Defense officer. I figured that if he knew how pilots operated that should help him shoot them down.

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                            • #15
                              [QUOTE=matthew.ritchie]
                              4. I brought in a US Navy lieutenant (O3) to the Guard. He was a Tomcat F14 pilot. We don't have those, but we got him reclassified as an Air Defense officer. I figured that if he knew how pilots operated that should help him shoot them down.[/QUOTE]

                              :D made me laugh....

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