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Question for someone who is knowledgeable/expert on NCO Promotions

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  • Question for someone who is knowledgeable/expert on NCO Promotions

    OK here is the skinny:

    An ARNG soldier recieves and EPS offer to E6 for an 11B3V slot in August of 2008. The soldier, at that time, was an 11B2P and serving in the same unit that the EPS offer was from (an Infantry - ABN LRS unit). The soldier was told that he would not actually be promoted until he completed Ranger School and had the "V" identifier. The soldier accepted the offer and the slot.

    At the time of the EPS offer/acceptance this soldier was put on LOD for injuries sustained while perfoming his duties at an Annual Training, the LOD was long term and his school slot was lost and was undergoing medical treatment for a period of 2.5 years (partly due to a misdiagnosis that required more time to treat).

    In 2010, due to deployent structure the "V" requirement as dropped and he was promoted to E6 in May of that year.

    The question is:

    Can this soldier pursue an administrative change in Date of Rank based on the EPS offer/acceptance date (with no claims or requests for any back pay/pay differentials from AUG 2008 through May 2010); and if so, what is the appropriate route to take, regulations to site, etc?

    Any help would be appreciated.
    Last edited by LRSU_Dog; July 27th, 2011, 01:06 PM.

  • #2
    Re: Question on NCO Promotion issue

    I would not think so because this is a new grade that he never had before and I only seen that when soldiers moved between components and took a voluntarily reduction. I guess the purpose of this so he can increase his TIG and be eligible for the next grade ASAP.

    I would have the soldier talk to his S1 on the matter but they would probably not know what to do in this scenario.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Question on NCO Promotion issue

      I'm pretty sure he wont be able to get the DOR changed, but I've got my 600-8-19 out and I'm digging around for "written" guidance.


      Here is something to think about though...What about all the other soldiers that were previously selected for promotions in that unit and had to wait until they were "V" qualified to get their promotion? Should they now be able to ask for their DOR to be pushed back to when they were initially selected too? I think not.
      Last edited by HR NCO; July 27th, 2011, 03:39 PM.

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      • #4
        Re: Question on NCO Promotion issue

        No way.........

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Question on NCO Promotion issue

          I've never heard of a promotion being denied for the lack of an ASI. As long as he wasn't flagged, met the NCOES requirements ect, he should've been promoted. This sounds like an over eager unit leadership trying to motivate NCO's.

          He needs to make them show in the reg how they denied him the promotion.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Question on NCO Promotion issue

            There were no letters describing the issue, 2 soldiers affected (the LOD soldier missed his shot at RGR, the other soldier went and made it) no issues in regards to flags, NCOERs were all good.

            As a CC I have tried to look for info but came up blank as far as any specific decriptions of this type of action - both in regards to the promotion issue and the DOR change question. As the soldier held the correct MOS (not including the ASI) I have come up against the arguement that the ASI as part of the MOS and slot meant the soldier was promoted into a slot he was not fully MOSQ for, hence the delay in promotion until the new deployment parent unit (a IBCT) the LRS was attached to had no Ranger requirements.

            Still a bit lost, and getting a run-around - but if a definate answer can be found - I will be able to advise accordingly.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Question on NCO Promotion issue

              Originally posted by RedLeg View Post
              I've never heard of a promotion being denied for the lack of an ASI. As long as he wasn't flagged, met the NCOES requirements ect, he should've been promoted. This sounds like an over eager unit leadership trying to motivate NCO's.

              He needs to make them show in the reg how they denied him the promotion.
              In the 75th Ranger Battalions you cannot hold a leadership position without being tabbed. Pretty sure what happens in that situation is the commander Non Recs the NCO when it comes time for promotion. Now granted, we are talking about a LRS NG unit and not the 75TH but if the LRS unit was originally structured in a way to reflect the same or similar standards as the 75th then I can see how a NCO would be denied promotion due to not being tabbed.

              I would think that there should have been some sort of official guidance or policy letter signed by the TAG for that to actually be enforced. In either case the NCO probably(or should have) had the option to go to the promotion board with the stipulation that if he were to get promoted he would have to accept the promotion with a different unit.

              I don't see this soldier getting his DOR changed even with the best of luck. If he wanted to advance then he probably could have transfered to a normal infantry company where there would be more available slots and not an ASI requirement. For me personally, I would turn down a promotion this year in exchange for a Ranger School slot in a heart beat.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Question on NCO Promotion issue

                Originally posted by SGT Juggernaut View Post
                In the 75th Ranger Battalions you cannot hold a leadership position without being tabbed. Pretty sure what happens in that situation is the commander Non Recs the NCO when it comes time for promotion. Now granted, we are talking about a LRS NG unit and not the 75TH but if the LRS unit was originally structured in a way to reflect the same or similar standards as the 75th then I can see how a NCO would be denied promotion due to not being tabbed.

                I would think that there should have been some sort of official guidance or policy letter signed by the TAG for that to actually be enforced. In either case the NCO probably(or should have) had the option to go to the promotion board with the stipulation that if he were to get promoted he would have to accept the promotion with a different unit.

                I don't see this soldier getting his DOR changed even with the best of luck. If he wanted to advance then he probably could have transfered to a normal infantry company where there would be more available slots and not an ASI requirement. For me personally, I would turn down a promotion this year in exchange for a Ranger School slot in a heart beat.
                Not true at all and it's an apples/oranges comparison.

                Do I have to have my Ranger tab in order to become a member of the 75th Ranger Regiment?
                No, you can come to the Ranger Regiment without being Ranger and/or Airborne qualified. However, some officers are required to be Ranger qualified before they are eligible to apply to the Ranger Regiment. This requirement applies to Infantry and Field Artillery Officers.
                Found here

                The simple fact that the "V" ASI is no longer needed so they can deploy tells me this is COC imposed and if push came to shove they have over stepped their boundaries.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Question on NCO Promotion issue

                  Originally posted by RedLeg View Post
                  Not true at all and it's an apples/oranges comparison.

                  Found here

                  The simple fact that the "V" ASI is no longer needed so they can deploy tells me this is COC imposed and if push came to shove they have over stepped their boundaries.
                  From the same source you quoted

                  "The 75th Ranger Regiment does require that its leaders attend the U.S. Army Ranger School; however, it is not a pre-requisite to join the Ranger Regiment in all instances. All Infantry and Artillery Military Occupational Specialties (MOS) must complete the course before they assume a leadership role in the Regiment. The remainder of the MOS's in the Regiment send their leaders when they are ready."

                  I know that a NG LRS unit is not the same as the 75th. However, if they modeled themselves to have the same or similar standards as the 75th then I can see why they would try to enforce thier policy. Question is was it legal for them to do so?

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