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  • Inquiring about Army Special Schools...

    Can anybody tell if while in the National Guard, are Guard soldiers able/allowed to go to Airborne school and Ranger school?...and if so which MOS's are able to do so....ONLY Infantry or any such as MP's...

  • #2
    Re: Inquiring about Army Special Schools...

    Originally posted by Alfredo Sanchez Jr. View Post
    Can anybody tell if while in the National Guard, are Guard soldiers able/allowed to go to Airborne school and Ranger school?...and if so which MOS's are able to do so....ONLY Infantry or any such as MP's...
    Are they able to ....yes.

    Will the state actually ever spend the money to send you....most likely never.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Inquiring about Army Special Schools...

      3 people from my whole battalion have been to Ranger school since I've been in. They all had 300 on the APFTand completed necessary NCOES.

      Is it possible? Like stated above, yes. If you show your chain of command you're worthy, you may get a shot.

      A good buddy of mine went to sniper school as well.

      Those possibilities are out there.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Inquiring about Army Special Schools...

        Those schools exist to serve the needs of the force, and are designed to improve the performance or capabilities of the Soldier attending them. Thus, maintenance Soldiers don't go to Ranger School very often, and Infantrymen don't usually go to Master Mechanic school. Similarly, Soldiers in non-Airborne units won't go to Airborne School. Since school slots and funding are limited, the State must prioritize both the schools and the Soldiers we send. Plenty of Soldiers get promoted to CSM without a tab, but none get promoted without completing the required NCOES. Thus, ordinary, non-sexy schools get priority over the glamorous ones.

        All that to say, be the best Soldier you can be, volunteer for additional opportunities, and constantly seek self-improvement. You may still never get Ranger School, but you'll still be better off somehow.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Inquiring about Army Special Schools...

          ParalegalNCO1 hit the nail on the head. It is highly unlikely, but not impossible. There are several LRS units that expect their NCO's to be tabbed, and all personnel to be jump qualified. If you join one of these units, you will be sent to BAC and possibly to Ranger School later, if you prove to your chain-of-command that you have what it takes. If you are in a line unit, your best chance to go to Ranger School is as an 11B. The only non-infantry guardsman I know who got his tab in the Guard was a medic assigned to a LRS unit. I highly doubt any NG MP will be sent to the school.

          If you are an 11B in a line unit, the key is persistence. It took me 5 years of asking, 2 deployments, maxing my PT test every year, and becoming an NCO before I finally convinced my COC to send me to Ranger School. Even then, the only way I got a slot is because we have a tabbed Battalion CSM who pushed to see more tabbed junior leaders. I still have not been able to obtain an Airborne slot. My Battalion sent 3 soldiers to Ranger School last year, and we all came back with a tab. We all recycled at least one phase, but after seeing how hard it wass to get a slot, there was no way we were coming home empty handed. If you want this school, you will have to prove yourself to your chain of command every day. Don't just try to meet the standard. Push yourself to be the very best at every endeavor of your military career. Never settle for mediocrity. If you can demonstrate top notch professionalism and leadership potential, you will have a better chance of convincing them to make an investment in you as a leader. This school is not some ticket-punch to get some shiny new tough guy bling for your uniform. If that is your goal, then you need not even ask to go. Demonstrate to them that you want to go in order to be the best possible leader that you can be. Show them that you view the tab as a future insurance policy for any men that you may one day lead into combat. Because at the end of the day, that's all Ranger School is: a leadership school...and a damn good one at that.

          If you are fortunate enough to snag a slot, you will have to successfully complete the National Guard Warrior Training Center's Ranger Training and Assessment Course (previously Pre-Ranger) before you are allowed to start Ranger School. Historically NG soldiers have had horrible graduation rates at RS, and this course was designed to change that. The first week of the course is primarily attrition based. Each day consists of graded events (RPFT, CWST, land nav, etc). Failure in any one of these will get you sent home or recycled. The second week consists of cadre-lead, cadre assisted, and graded student-lead patrols to teach you the fundamentals of patrolling that you will need in Darby Phase. This course is very difficult (my class had around a 20% pass rate), but if you make it through, you will drastically increase your chances of success at Ranger School. Because of the success of this program, many Active Duty soldiers are sent to RTAC from units that do not have a Pre-Ranger program. All inter-service and foreign students also attend RTAC. National Guard soldiers actually make up a minority of each class, so the standards are very high to begin with. This is no gentleman's course, and some elements were actually more difficult than RAP week of Ranger School. I can honestly say that there is no way that I would have gotten my tab without attending RTAC prior to Ranger School.

          Another thing to consider, is that with a shrinking defense budget, it will be increasingly harder to get any non-essential school, especially as an enlisted soldier. Honestly if Airborne and Ranger School is a key goal of yours, you will have the best chance as an Infantry Officer. Most ROTC programs send students to BAC between their MSII and MSIII years. If you branch Infantry, you will have a very good chance of picking up a Ranger slot after IBOLC.

          Good luck.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Inquiring about Army Special Schools...

            Originally posted by matthew.ritchie View Post
            Thus, ordinary, non-sexy schools get priority over the glamorous ones.
            I don't know sir, NCOES is looking like Mila Kunis right now to me.....no one will fund it.
            Last edited by ParalegalNCO1; January 9th, 2013, 04:18 PM.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Inquiring about Army Special Schools...

              Originally posted by ParalegalNCO1 View Post
              I don't know sir, NCOES is looking like Mila Kunis right now to me.....no one will fund it.
              NJ does not even send SGTs to WLC due to "funding". We don't send officers to OES until it is required for promotion.

              Basically, what they are trying to say is that "we need all the bodies but we don't actually have a way of developing the careers of the better performers". The solution that makes sense given the level of funding is to drastically stand a good portion of the force down and hand out a bunch of pink slips.

              Originally posted by matthew.ritchie View Post
              All that to say, be the best Soldier you can be, volunteer for additional opportunities, and constantly seek self-improvement. You may still never get Ranger School, but you'll still be better off somehow.
              If someone wants to attend Army ASI courses, the best shot they will have is to serve in a NG SF unit. Earlier this fiscal year, NJ (lied) said that there would be the opportunity to attend ASI courses under 15 days. I put in a request for Air Assault school. (I had little hope in it coming through because not too much does come through in NJ.) Long and behold I was basically told, "You can attend an ASI course that is under 15 days and does not start with the letter 'A'." Not playing that game anymore.
              Last edited by Polo08816; January 9th, 2013, 07:50 PM.

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              • #8
                Re: Inquiring about Army Special Schools...

                The funding situation with NCOES courses is down right criminal. I told my leadership I will not be attending any more NCO profeesional development crap, nor do I need any "mentorship" from the senior NCO's. What I need is someone to sign a check. Considering my technical competency is far greater than most of my "seniors", there wasn't much room for an argument.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Inquiring about Army Special Schools...

                  When I was in the Guard and Reserves; hooah schools were unheard of. Over the past decade, I saw how the NG has established many hooah school training at NG posts.

                  Compared to AD, what is the process for a Soldier in the NG to try to get to these schools; especially if they are located in other states?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Inquiring about Army Special Schools...

                    Originally posted by ParalegalNCO1 View Post
                    The funding situation with NCOES courses is down right criminal. I told my leadership I will not be attending any more NCO profeesional development crap, nor do I need any "mentorship" from the senior NCO's. What I need is someone to sign a check. Considering my technical competency is far greater than most of my "seniors", there wasn't much room for an argument.
                    The funding situation is bad but that's not my biggest gripe. The biggest gripe is that our senior leaders don't have the spine to do the hard thing and start eliminating/cutting positions to shape the force into something that is consistent with the funding levels. Obviously we can't afford to be as large as we once were so let's produce a smaller and more versatile force filled with winners instead of just dead-beats (people who thought they could just tread water for a few more years).

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Inquiring about Army Special Schools...

                      Originally posted by fmcityslicker View Post
                      When I was in the Guard and Reserves; hooah schools were unheard of. Over the past decade, I saw how the NG has established many hooah school training at NG posts.

                      Compared to AD, what is the process for a Soldier in the NG to try to get to these schools; especially if they are located in other states?
                      Someone please approve my post.

                      The process of a Soldier (at the company level) of trying to get to these schools is simply to contact the Training NCO who will then ask BN to put reserve them a slot in ATTRS. Beyond that, I'm not entirely sure.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Inquiring about Army Special Schools...

                        Originally posted by fmcityslicker View Post
                        When I was in the Guard and Reserves; hooah schools were unheard of. Over the past decade, I saw how the NG has established many hooah school training at NG posts.

                        Compared to AD, what is the process for a Soldier in the NG to try to get to these schools; especially if they are located in other states?
                        Same thing as any Army unit. Request it in ATTRS, and then get the denial email by the J3 for lack of funding.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Inquiring about Army Special Schools...

                          Originally posted by ParalegalNCO1 View Post
                          Same thing as any Army unit. Request it in ATTRS, and then get the denial email by the J3 for lack of funding.
                          Ok. While on AD, when my Command has approved my request and it moved onto to my training NCO; G3 simply rubber stamped the approval. I am trying to get to the advanced course this year even though all slots for FY13 have been filled. I am getting in on stand-by and will wait and see.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Inquiring about Army Special Schools...

                            Originally posted by fmcityslicker View Post
                            Ok. While on AD, when my Command has approved my request and it moved onto to my training NCO; G3 simply rubber stamped the approval. I am trying to get to the advanced course this year even though all slots for FY13 have been filled. I am getting in on stand-by and will wait and see.
                            I usually don't B1tch about the system, but it is beyond frustrating that "they" want you to professionally develop along this magical timeline of promotions, yet when you get there and are ready to move, more "theys" are unable to fund the training or provide an available seat.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Inquiring about Army Special Schools...

                              Originally posted by ParalegalNCO1 View Post
                              I usually don't B1tch about the system, but it is beyond frustrating that "they" want you to professionally develop along this magical timeline of promotions, yet when you get there and are ready to move, more "theys" are unable to fund the training or provide an available seat.
                              +1. I think you have the right mindset. People need to stop making the military part of their long term life plans or count on military retirement. There are going to be drastic cuts in government spending one way or another.

                              Two major things will determine someone's financial success in the future:
                              1. Debt.
                              2. Skills as an entreprenuer.

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