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  • Counseling statement??

    Has anyone ever recieved a counseling statement via mail? Apparently I was supposed to get one, but never recieved it. I've gotten one once before like this and it confuses me. Isn't the soldier recieving it supposed to be present at the time it is given so both the soldier and the soldier giving it can both sign it?

  • #2
    Re: Counseling statement??

    By mail?? Never heard of such a thing....

    You are right, if it's worth documenting, it's worth a face to face conversation.

    Was your NCO THAT BUSY that he couldn't type it up and sit you down to discuss the matter?

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    • #3
      Re: Counseling statement??

      were you not there to do it in person? What was the counseling for? Did they counsel you by phone and then send the hard copy for you to sign? What is the whole story here?

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      • #4
        Re: Counseling statement??

        Must be the new Guard .

        Counselings should take place each month at drill with each soldier. When I was in the Guard, did it happen? Negative. To be honest, I have to be on top of soldiers who are active.

        E-4s in the Guards should receive NCOERs or am I wrong?

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        • #5
          Re: Counseling statement??

          I have printed this thread and am making it a power point topic for my next training session. This is ridiculous.

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          • #6
            Re: Counseling statement??

            it was for failing my 2mile run by 14 seconds and that if I do not pass next month's apft i will be reduced in rank and processed for discharge.Like i said i never actually recieved it or knew about it until it was mentioned to me at drill. I said i never got one and got accused of lying. I wasn't counseled over the phone either. So basically i was asked if I recieved it, i said no then i wastold what it was for.

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            • #7
              Re: Counseling statement??

              And this is why we don't do them via mail. It's all around jacked up. I'm no expert but can a soldier be processed for discharged for failing an APFT? Arent there some intermediate steps that need to be taken? Or is this a repeat performance?

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              • #8
                Re: Counseling statement??

                Of course they can be discharged for failing multiple APFTs. A counseling is basically a warning.

                Specialists should not get NCOERs because they are not NCOs. Only if they are corporals.

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                • #9
                  Re: Counseling statement??

                  For failing "A" APFT, No.

                  For failing two consecutive APFT's; it is a requirement to initiate a separation packet. Note that this does not mean separation. It means the decision making process has been started and it is up to the separation authority (TAG) to decide what to do. Unfortuantly in the Guard, they dork this up all the time.

                  A counseling statement is supposed to be to direct a plan of corrective action. It is supposed to have a before, what to do, and what was the result type sequence. Sending it in the mail is pointless, retarded, and defeats the purpose. This does not meet the requirements for separation found in the regulation covering mandatory counseling and rehabilitation.

                  Furthermore, I would love to know what authority they plan on using for a reduction, and if they would actually do the process. I am not saying it can't be done, I am saying they will do it wrong, they already have.

                  I continually use this example for reductions when I give a brief.......

                  I would love it if one day the Commander just came into the room and said "SSG Snuffy, you did freaking outstanding today. I just promoted you to SFC." We all know it doesn't work that way, there are boards, promotion point worksheets, timelines, things the soldier has to acknowledge...basically I am saying it doesn't just "happen". Soooo, why in the world units continually think they can just say "SSG Snuffy, I don't like the way you look, you are now a SGT" is absolutly beyond me. As I just said, it doesn't just "Happen". There is a process. A process they never want to do.

                  My favorite one is an administrative reduction for misconduct. With the exception of a conviction by a CIVILIAN court, and only that exception, a reduction for misconduct absolutley, 100%, positvely...DOES NOT EXIST. In any way shape or form. But, they do it all the time. They call the E-4 who cuts orders and it just "happens".

                  So frustrating.

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                  • #10
                    Re: Counseling statement??

                    Originally posted by Mr_Loki View Post
                    Specialists should not get NCOERs because they are not NCOs. Only if they are corporals.
                    Really? lol

                    I know that but I remember this practice in a PSD when I was in the Guard and was just asking if anybody else experienced this. It was not an NCOER that was filed but more to the level of a counseling statement. I am trying to recall that but the way my memory is (similar about the CW5 thread); I may be thinking of something else.

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                    • #11
                      Re: Counseling statement??

                      At least you are getting a statement, I failed my 2 mile run by about 10 seconds (my fault, I hadn't done enough cold weather running to be ready for it) and I didn't get any kind of counseling, I did get notice from HRC that the documentation for my Flag has been put into my iPerms though! I hope they process the flag removal as quick after I pass the test next month (well probably 2 months, going "camping" next drill).

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                      • #12
                        Re: Counseling statement??

                        This is the first apft I've failed. I just wasn't used to the cold weather. I just wanted to know if this is normal to recieve them this way. Now since I never actually recieved it in the mail and I was accused of lying what can I do about that, If there is anything I can do about it?

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                        • #13
                          Re: Counseling statement??

                          Originally posted by kswat07 View Post
                          This is the first apft I've failed. I just wasn't used to the cold weather. I just wanted to know if this is normal to recieve them this way. Now since I never actually recieved it in the mail and I was accused of lying what can I do about that, If there is anything I can do about it?
                          There is nothing you need to do about it right now except pass your APFT test and it becomes moot. If they proceed with the separation process this is something you can address in a rebuttal if you submit one.

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                          • #14
                            Re: Counseling statement??

                            I agree with Para on this one: I'm thinking your rebuttal will be stronger than what ever they put on paper, especially you "lying" about whether or not you received anything in the mail.

                            1) If they felt that strongly about it, they would have done the counselling in person.

                            2) They would have put a signature receipt on the envelope.

                            Failing to do either of the above is just lazy in my eyes.

                            Agreed, it's on you to pass the run, but as far as the admin stuff, your chain has failed miserably.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Counseling statement??

                              Originally posted by fmcityslicker View Post
                              Must be the new Guard .

                              Counselings should take place each month at drill with each soldier. When I was in the Guard, did it happen? Negative. To be honest, I have to be on top of soldiers who are active.

                              E-4s in the Guards should receive NCOERs or am I wrong?
                              My undestanding is that E-4s in the NG receive a 4100.
                              Last edited by Polo08816; February 24th, 2012, 02:59 PM.

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